In reply to Bill Nye and Most Christians vs. Ken Ham and Creationism – Part I is the following from Jon –
 

Part of the issue is that we are making science square off against religion.

We?

Don’t blame science for this problem with religion.

Some religious preachers are claiming that evolution denialism Creationism should be taught as science.

Promotion of bad science is justifiably opposed by scientists.

Preachers should not promote bad science.
 

Original Creationist ‘watch as proof of design’ image credit.
 

The superficial appearance of design in living things is not proof that evolution is wrong and is not proof of intelligent design Creationism.

Science is not satisfied with the superficial.

Creationism is contradicted by almost all of science and is not even supported by most religious people.
 

The Inquisition threatened Galileo (a very religious scientist) with torture, forced Galileo to shut up, and placed Galileo under house arrest for the rest of his life.

Why?

Galileo showed that the real world ignores the Biblical literalists.

Science eventually prevailed, but the Biblical literalists were able to hold back science for years decades centuries.

The Bible did not change, but many literal interpretations of the Bible evolved.

Image credit.
 

Should we change the Bible to match science?

Should we change science to match the Bible?

Should we just keep scientifically illiterate preachers out of science classrooms, so that they are less likely to embarrass themselves?

Science does not care what is revealed about the world, as long as it is true, but Creationists only care about the end justifying their interpretations of the Bible.
 

If Genesis said, “And God caused there to be something from nothing, and this something went “kaplowie”, and God caused the things from the kaplowie to start swirling and condensing into globs of matter, and those globs of matter hardened, and on one of those globs came forth water and land, and a microbe developed into an animal and a plant, and reproduced, and evolved into myriad forms” would that be acceptable to those that hold fast to evolution?

Changing the Bible does not change reality.

What if the Bible said, The Earth is not the center of everything?

Would Galileo’s prosecution by Biblical literalists go away?

Eventually, Biblical literalists will also admit the error of their ways about evolution.

For our children, grandchildren, great grandchildren, . . ., let’s hope the Biblical literalists repent more quickly this time.
 

Finally, let’s say that those that understand Scripture’s “six days of creation” are mistaken, . . . .

Science makes it clear that preachers of Scripture’s “six days of creation” are mistaken.

Most people believe in God and ignore these literal interpretations of the Bible advocated by some preachers.

There is no valid evidence to support Creationism.

This is only a controversy among religious sects.

This is not a controversy among scientists.

.

Continuing, on Darwin Day, from Part I about the debate between Bill Nye and Ken Ham about whether Creationism should be taught in science classrooms.

Ken Ham’s Creationism is a religious belief that humans were placed on the Earth in their current form by Ken Ham’s interpretation of a Christian God about 6,000 years ago.

At the end of Part I, I wrote that I would review the science that supports Creationism here.

Here is the valid science to support Creationism.

Nothing. 😳

In stead of science, we get excuses for ignoring valid science. We get misrepresentations of mathematics used to make evolution seem impossible.

Preachers will tell you that evolution is a form of atheism, but that is a lie.

Most religious people are not Creationists, so are most religious people lying about what they believe?

Even Pat Robertson rejects Ken Han’s Creationism.
 

“We have skeletons of dinosaurs that go back 65 million years,” Robertson said. “To say it all dates back to 6,000 years is just nonsense, and I think [it’s] time we come off of that stuff, and say this isn’t possible.”

“Let’s be real; let’s not make a joke of ourselves,” he said.^[1]

Pew Researh Center poll.^[2]
 

Are Creationist preachers being honest about what others believe?

Do Creationist preachers make a lot of unsupportable assumptions?
 

One of the scientists Ken Ham used as an example of Creationism and science being compatible is Andrew Fabich, Ph.D., who had to learn evolution to get his PhD, but rejects evolution and teaches for a Creationist school. He claims that the LTEE (Long Term Evolution Experiment – evolution demonstrated in the laboratory) is just an example of a simple gene being turned on and not an example of evolution.

Real scientists immediately saw the nonsense in the claim of Andrew Fabich, Ph.D. that this was just turning on a switch and not evolution, but this Creation scientist is still making the same debunked claim. Does misunderstanding become understanding when it is repeated enough? No.
 

Of course, if it were so easy as a single, simple mutation, then we would have seen that capability evolve in many or all of the populations. But after almost 60,000 generations to date, only one population has evolved that ability.^[3]

If 12 computers required over 60,000 clicks of a mouse before just one computer would produce an effect they were designed to produce, would anyone call that an Intelligent Design?

Andrew Fabich, Ph.D. is supposed to be an example of a Creationist being able to be successful as a scientist. A similar example would be that Michael Phelps was caught smoking from a bong and he won more Olympic gold medals than anyone else. Bong hits and Olympic gold are compatible!

Unlike Creationists, Michael Phelps has apologized for his bad judgment.^[4]
 

The most famous Creationist scientist is Michael Behe, Ph.D. He was an expert witness at the trial that examined whether Intelligent Design is science.

The case for the Creationists ID (Intelligent Design) proponents was to try to show that ID is science and not religion.
 

Q But you are clear, under your definition, the definition that sweeps in intelligent design, astrology is also a scientific theory, correct?

A Yes, that’s correct.^[5]

Astrology is not science, but astrology is the same kind of science as Creationism Intelligent Design.

That is from the best scientist they could find to present their case. ID is as good as astrology.
 

–

Footnotes:

–

^[1] Pat Robertson rejects ‘young earth’ creationism. ‘Nonsense,’ he says. (+video)
By Harry Bruinius, Staff writer
February 6, 2014
Christian Science Monitor
Article

–

^[2] Public’s Views on Human Evolution
Pew Research Center
December 30, 2013
Article.

Free Full Text in PDF format from Pew Research Center.

–

^[3] Zachary Blount on “Ham on Nye” Debate, Follow-up #3
February 7, 2014
Zachary Blount
Telliamed Revisited
Article

–

^[4] Phelps: Photo with marijuana pipe real
Updated: February 2, 2009, 7:40 AM ET
Associated Press
ESPN
Article

–

^[5] Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District – Trial transcript: Day 11 (October 18), PM Session, Part 1
Talk Origins
Transcript

.

Skip to 13:00 for the beginning of the debate.
 

Is it impossible to be a scientist and a Young Earth Creationist? No, but good science did not come from the Lysenkoists^[1] of the Soviet Union, who also opposed evolution. Lysenkoists were still successful scientists – in the Soviet Union.

Ken Ham (multimillionaire CEO of a corporation that exists to sell Creationism with the home field advantage of a Creationist-packed crowd at the Creation museum) suggests that the ability of a few Creationists to become successful scientists is proof that you do not need to understand evolution to be a successful scientist.

This is misleading, which is a common Ken Ham tactic. It is much more difficult to become a successful scientist with a major misunderstanding of science. A tall person to become a gymnast, or a jockey, but that is not proof that being tall is not an obstacle to success in both fields.

There are doctors who are claim that AIDS (Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome) is not caused by HIV (Human Immunodeficiency Virus),^[2] historians who claim that the Holocaust is a myth,^[3] and pediatricians who claim that vaccines are the root of all evil,^[4] but these flaws in their understanding are obstacles that they have to overcome. Some will make their misunderstanding their source of income.

These conspiracy theorists claim to know the truth, while the rest of us are deceived. They claim to be misunderstood geniuses, just like Galileo.

However, Galileo’s opposition was from a political faction within the Catholic Church. This faction claimed that Aristotle’s ideas were not to be challenged, even though Galileo could demonstrate that Aristotle was wrong about some things, he could not demonstrate this for everything.

According to Ken Ham, Galileo was wrong, since the experimental conditions could not be produced to demonstrate that Galileo was right.

Galileo could not watch objects falling in a vacuum, but that did not mean that the rate of acceleration due to gravity was different for feathers and hammers.

Just because we cannot watch evolution happening quickly, does not mean that evolution is not happening, no matter how much Ken Ham wishes it were true.
 

The Catholic Church learned a lot about science in the hundreds of years since locking up Galileo. The Catholic Church accepts that evolution is real.

The Catholic Church has not eliminated Genesis from the Bible, but still rejects Ken Ham’s literal misinterpretation of Genesis.
 

Stuart Burgess, PhD states (at 30:55) –
 

I find that many of my colleagues in academia are sympathetic to the Creationist viewpoint, including biologists, however they are often afraid to speak out because of the criticisms they would get from the media and atheist lobby.

Maybe the biologists are just being polite to the Creationist. Maybe they are just sick of repeatedly trying to explain to an engineer (someone who is expected to see design in things) that not everything is designed.

Some of us will patronize (or ignore) a misguided colleague, rather than trying to reason with the obtuse, when we could be accomplishing something useful.

Where does this myth that scientists fear criticism by the media or the atheist lobby come from?

If scientists are more worried about the media than about evidence, then they are really just politicians.
 

Ken Ham claims that the laws of nature, laws of logic, and the uniformity of nature are evidence of Creationism.

Do nature and logic work differently in places that are not Christian?

Ken Ham asked where the laws of nature, laws of logic, and uniformity of nature came from?

Logic and uniformity?
 

Ken Ham is a literalist, but does not understand that a literal interpretation of the Bible does not support logic and uniformity.

Why argue with logic that is so illogical?
 

At 34:00, Ken Ham states –
 

When I was at the Goddard Space Center, I met Creationists and evolutionists who were both working on the Hubble Telescope. They agreed on how to build the Hubble Telescope. You know what they disagreed on? Well, they disagreed on how to interpret the data the telescope obtained in regard to the age of the universe.

What does evolution have to do with the age of the universe?

The age of the universe is determined by other fields of science.

However, Ken Ham’s science book does not define the length of a day and is not specific about what is intended by the word begat. This literalism seems to be an obstacle to understanding any meaning of generation.

The term Founding Fathers will baffle these literalists, if they approach it the same way they approach the Bible.
 

At 47:00 Ken Ham claims that the Bible does not support any view of different races, such as might be used to support slavery, or a chosen people.

OK, Ken Ham did not mention that a literal interpretation of the Bible actually does support slavery of other races and does spend a lot of time on the chosen people, but this is Ken Ham, so he is only literal when it suits him. 😳
 

I am less than an hour in, but this is more than enough to show that Ken Ham does not understand science.
 

The evidence just for human evolution is extensive (1,950 papers – over 100 papers each year since 2006) and well reviewed by scientists.
 

PubMed search for “human evolution.”
 

The evidence for Creation science is insignificant (only 19 papers) – and most of these papers are critical of this oxymoron.
 

PubMed search for “creation science.”
 

Evolution is a branch of science.

Creation science is a form of religion.

The debate is between religious people who understand science and religious people who do not understand science.

–

Footnotes:

–

^[1] Lysenkoism
Wikipedia
Article

–

^[2] Denial, conspiracies, and misconceptions
HIV/AIDS
Wikipedia
Article

–

^[3] Holocaust denial
Wikipedia
Article

–

^[4] Vaccine controversies
Wikipedia
Article

.